EREV

[awd]

Range and charging speed is what will make my decision on if I buy the ranchero or RamRev next year. I drive 300 miles highway about once a month and would like to be able to do it with less than 10 minutes of stopping. So really want 400+ miles listed range on the higher trim. I drive 140-150 miles highway round trip once a week and would be able to cover most of that on battery in an EREV, burning 1-2 gal of gas each trip which might be helpful to keep the fuel from spoiling.

400+ miles would be great to leave a buffer for longer trips. if you don't mind driving under the speed limit, i imagine you wouldn't have any issue making 300 miles on a fully charged battery without needing any charging stops.. although the UEV is designed for aerodynamics, going slower is a sure way to gain more range, and i've easily seen 25%+ more efficiency / range than vehicle ratings when driving slower (though other drivers in a hurry passing may get annoying depending on traffic).

 

[Snakebitten]

400 miles with LFP would require more battery than I believe is intended for this first vehicle on the UEV platform.

I'm not saying that the platform itself isn't more capable of carrying a large battery. But a 100KW LFP? I don't think there's a single EV sold in America with an LFP battery that large.

There several EV's with batteries as big, bigger, and much bigger. But none of them are LFP

 

[dorbi]

Yeah, I think some peoples aspirations for this Ranchero are going to leave them very disappointed.

We also need to look no further than Jim's own mouth:

Excerpt from The Sun:
"The Ford team is now going in the direction of more compact, affordable vehicles that can turn a profit for the brand.

Because of this, American Ford lovers must get over their want for vehicles with more than 300-400 miles of range, the Ford CEO explained."
___
People need to keep reality and physics in mind. You're not going to get a pickup that's $30,000, has 400 miles of range, has a 7500lb tow capacity, etc.

If you tow large things across the country, I'd argue this pickup won't be for you.

If you must drive 400 miles with an arbitrary 10 minute cutoff for fueling, this pickup may not be for you.

 

[Snakebitten]

Excellent points.
Completely agree.

This is the electric Maverick.
The affordable and profitable American (non-Chinese) compact 4-door truck.

I own an Electric American made 4-door truck with 400 mile range and can tow.
It's NOT profitable!
It's NOT LFP
It's NOT affordable

Just the battery required for accomplishing that co$t more than a Maverick or a Ranchero. It's massive!

 

[awd]

400 miles with LFP would require more battery than I believe is intended for this first vehicle on the UEV platform.

I'm not saying that the platform itself isn't more capable of carrying a large battery. But a 100KW LFP? I don't think there's a single EV sold in America with an LFP battery that large.

There several EV's with batteries as big, bigger, and much bigger. But none of them are LFP

i don't anticipate seeing them offer this much range unless their aerodynamics are resulting in 5+ mi/kWh. it's possible that a 100 kWh battery may not fit if the pickup is small (though i think some LFP cars exist overseas that have this size battery and the UEV pickup would likely be at least as long as those).

Yeah, I think some peoples aspirations for this Ranchero are going to leave them very disappointed.

We also need to look no further than Jim's own mouth:

Excerpt from The Sun:
"The Ford team is now going in the direction of more compact, affordable vehicles that can turn a profit for the brand.

Because of this, American Ford lovers must get over their want for vehicles with more than 300-400 miles of range, the Ford CEO explained."
___
People need to keep reality and physics in mind. You're not going to get a pickup that's $30,000, has 400 miles of range, has a 7500lb tow capacity, etc.

If you tow large things across the country, I'd argue this pickup won't be for you.

If you must drive 400 miles with an arbitrary 10 minute cutoff for fueling, this pickup may not be for you.

while i've written about wanting an EREV and would buy it if were an option, i'm also not expecting to see it offered, at least not initially. i do not recall ever reading that the UEV platform was being planned with EREV options, however Jim Farley has spoken praise about this drivetrain type in the past, so i wouldn't be surprised if they are engineering the platform in a manner that they can add a simple gas powered engine / generator in the future.

i still may consider the UEV pickup even if it does not offer an EREV, though would probably go with a van or a Maverick instead. despite wanting to support the new affordable platform (and not wanting to pay high gas prices), i honestly don't think the UEV pickup will work for my current vehicle needs, and know i'd be better off with a gas vehicle for now.

if the UEV cargo van is available around the same $30k price point with a few hundred miles of range (or with 100-150 miles of all electric range and a gas powered range extender), i would be much more likely to get that than the pickup, especially if it has dimensions of a midsize van like the Transit City that was recently released in Europe.

Excellent points.
Completely agree.

This is the electric Maverick.
The affordable and profitable American (non-Chinese) compact 4-door truck.

I own an Electric American made 4-door truck with 400 mile range and can tow.
It's NOT profitable!
It's NOT LFP
It's NOT affordable

Just the battery required for accomplishing that co$t more than a Maverick or a Ranchero. It's massive!

if it is the electric Maverick, i really hope it does have a solution for towing.

if the battery is small and it can barely tow 100 miles between charges, it would only be useful for local towing, unless someone really wants to prove it can be done by stopping every couple hours at charger locations that mostly aren't yet designed for long vehicles (and with a charge port location that is not good for towing without blocking many adjacent spaces, per posted photos that show it near the rear).

 

[thum]

For the record I’m not hoping for around 400 miles epa in a 30k truck. I am hoping that they can get around that with a fully loaded long range version in the mid 40s. If they can fit a 100 kWh with around 4 mi/kwh that would do it. Our ev6 averages 3.9, so it’s not crazy.

Ford is also using CATL tech for their batteries, which should give them decent density.

My thought on price is if Chevy can push out a full size truck with a 119 kWh NMC for 55k, then it’s not unreasonable to think that Ford can push out a 100kwh LFP on a smaller and cheaper to build truck for 45k. I guess it depends on if the smaller truck can carry the weight and has the space for the cells.

 

[dorbi]

if the battery is small and it can barely tow 100 miles between charges, it would only be useful for local towing, unless someone really wants to prove it can be done by stopping every couple hours at charger locations that mostly aren't yet designed for long vehicles (and with a charge port location that is not good for towing without blocking many adjacent spaces, per posted photos that show it near the rear).

But that’s exactly what it’s going to be, right? I think people just are looking at this thing with the wrong mindset. They’ve said time and time again, both Jim Farley and Alan Clarke, that this is not meant for people towing big things long distances. So expecting it to tow big things long distances is just setting yourself up for disappointment.

This happened a ton on the Slate Forums, too.

 

[thum]

But that’s exactly what it’s going to be, right? I think people just are looking at this thing with the wrong mindset. They’ve said time and time again, both Jim Farley and Alan Clarke, that this is not meant for people towing big things long distances. So expecting it to tow big things long distances is just setting yourself up for disappointment.

This happened a ton on the Slate Forums, too.

Anyone who needs to tow more than 100 miles with any regularity should be looking at an EREV or prepare to drop $70+k on a Silverado long range.

 

[Snakebitten]

I do think that Ford can put a 100KWH battery in the platform, easy enough. Just not with the current LFP they are building in Michigan.

 

[ScooterAsheville]

I always try to keep in mind the constant improvements in battery tech and manufacturing. I think the number I read a lot is 8% a year on average, industry wide, over the last few decades. It was not that long ago that EV batteries were $1,000 per KwH. Now they are $100. Some say the Chinese have them down to $60 already.

So if the UEV comes with 300 miles range in 2027, 400 miles at the same price is 33% improvement, which comes out to be sometime around 2031 (for the same cost, at an 8% per annum cost-performance improvement slope).

That's what I love about EVs. They just get better each year, cost less each year, and are better supported by infrastructure each year.

 

[Snakebitten]

I admit that if we were currently in the year of 2031, the speculation boundaries would be very different

 

[ScooterAsheville]

I only keep the near future in mind because it affects my personal buying decisions. I have a perfectly good Maverick in the driveway. So I'm not in any rush to pull the trigger on an EV. I'm aware there's probably something better for less just down the road a year or two.

It takes me back to buying a computer in the early 1980's. As a software engineer, I needed the latest and the bestest RIGHT NOW. So I dumped $1,800 every year on a new PC, and it paid me back ten fold in productivity. But somebody didn't need that? The computer they had did what they needed? Heck, that's $1,800 they kept in their pockets.

Somebody else, not in the same place as me car-wise, and needing a ride RIGHT NOW, 2031 might as well be 2051. I get it.

 

[Snakebitten]

I'm old.
Running out of time to enjoy the latest and greatest.

Or put another way, I'm currently running low on DaveRamseySelfDisciline.

But I'm well aware that this window of economic recklessness is finite. Small. Brief. Could end today, in fact.

Wishing that the 2036 EREV truck to be available NOW. Because otherwise, it won't be an option for me.

 

[WXman]

___
People need to keep reality and physics in mind. You're not going to get a pickup that's $30,000, has 400 miles of range, has a 7500lb tow capacity, etc.

Anyone who needs to tow more than 100 miles with any regularity should be looking at an EREV or prepare to drop $70+k on a Silverado long range.

If we're talking electric trucks, then yes. This is true. Battery packs are PRICEY to produce and sell.

But let's not forget that you can still buy gasoline trucks in the $30k's that have over 400 miles of range and tow over 8,000 lbs.

 

[Snakebitten]

Not exactly a cross shopping scenario though with a Ranchero or Maverick.

Chevy WT 1500 with the 2.7?
F150 XL 2.7?

And even those ICE truck with 400 miles range and 8000lbs towing capacity, is going to experience a very similar hit in range when towing.