Can Ford IT be trusted?

[mark]

https://www.mavericktruckclub.com/forum/threads/how-bad-are-these-electronics-issues.87519/

This recent experience is what concerns me about the new Fathom, and really any new introduction. if Ford can not get the Maverick right after 5 years, what should we anticipate for the Fathom?

 

[commadorebob]

That is one example of the 500,000+ Mavericks sold. Even Tesla has to provide regular software updates to fix things.

 

[mark]

What was your support experience with two Ford product lines?
My brother had a 23 Bronco Sport with a rough transmission that went away in sport mode. that sounded like software to me after he discribed it. He traded for a recent hybrid Escape and loves it.
I’m ot trashing Ford. I also realize that this is new from top to bottom, including the personnel. Since you are an IT person, what would you antiicipate with the Fathom at introduction?

 

[ScooterAsheville]

The automotive software stack is a thing unto itself. From what I've read, the team developing it is not connected to the legacy Ford team. We're all just going to have to wait and see how it all works.

I spent decades as a software engineer in the Advanced Research & Development division of a Fortune 50 tech corporation. I did both embedded and non embedded development in a high-demand, time-critical, safety-critical, reliability-critical environment. My experiences taught me to have intense respect for the guys and gals developing an automotive tech stack.

• Software development is a minefield.
• Embedded development is a bigger minefield.
• Embedded where people's lives are at stake is an even bigger minefield.
• Embedded where people's lives are at stake and the customers routinely abuse the product in an extremely harsh environment is a world-class minefield.
• Trying to explain an incredibly complex craft to a guy on the street is the biggest minefield of all.

I figure we can all cut these guys and gals some slack, since nobody on this forum or on the Internet has seen what they're writing.

Also, the whole "Maverick sucks, and therefore Fathom will suck" argument rings hollow to me. Different teams. Different software architecture. Different hardware architecture. Different capabilities. Different design concepts.

There is exactly one accurate thing to say about the new Ford software. Nobody on this forum or any other forum has a frigging clue. Except maybe Riley

 

[mark]

Thanks. All feed back is appreciated. My son is currently a sofetware infrastructure engineer with a global electrical corporation. I have not asked for his opinion, since the reply would echo yours. I intend to go with this and suck it up. Asheville caught hell from the hurricane. We just had tree damage. Hope you came through it OK.
Regarding Riley, I don’t expect him or her to respond to this thread.

 

[ScooterAsheville]

Thanks. All feed back is appreciated. My son is currently a sofetware infrastructure engineer with a global electrical corporation. I have not asked for his opinion, since the reply would echo yours. I intend to go with this and suck it up.

You asked a totally fair question. I drive a Maverick. I've had 4 recalls (done in the driveway by Ford Mobile Service), with one pending. They were painless. That legacy stack had plenty of teething problems. It's not unique to Ford. GM has been struggling with their Ultium platforms.

I can see how people looking at Maverick would wonder "are they ever going to get it right?". Again, it's a totally fair question to ask.

 

[commadorebob]

I'm actually an IT project manager and have a team of roughly 25 software developers in six states and Puerto Rico. I'm well aware of the SLDC process. We recently had to fix a defect from 2008 that didn't become visible until a month ago, when a user did something no one expected them to try. So, I understand it is not possible for Ford to test everything a buyer may try with their vehicle. That's why I tell my team to make sure they take the stupidest user into account in their unit testing.

The only one we had issues with was a 2022 Explorer I purchased, which I have since replaced with the Expedition. Ford tried to fix it with software, but it was ultimately a hardware issue.

I currently own three modern Fords.
2020 Escape SEL

• Son's Car
• Most recalls on it are hardware-related.
• While working on a hardware recall, they went ahead and updated the software.
• All done in my driveway.

2023 Maverick Lariat

• My truck.
• Only a handful of software updates.
• All done in my driveway

2025 Expedition Platinum Max

• Wife's truck
• Software updates all come OTA.
• I joined their software insider program for this one. They actually took my advice and put a clock on the massive instrument panel. You have no idea how excited I was about that!

 

[mark]

Qualified feedback is appreciated. Thank you both.

 

[ScooterAsheville]

I should add my favorite developer mantra here. IMHO, it summarizes my entire career in software...

The 6 Stages of Debugging

1. That can't happen.
2. That doesn't happen on my machine (or car or truck).
3. That shouldn't happen.
4. Why does that happen?
5. Oh, I see.
6. How did that ever work?

I have walked this path so many times...

 

[commadorebob]

Debugging steps I tell my team:

• Rule out operator error.
• Rule out tester error.
• Rule out developer error.
• When in doubt, reboot.

 

[ScooterAsheville]

In my division we had an adage: "Start by assuming it's your fault". That really worked to eliminate finger pointing. We had to work with an entire universe of third party hardware and software, so the natural human impulse to get defensive and finger point. It's a very human thing to start with denial of culpability.

 

[onuiebvbevnulib]

The good news for the Fathom is if a software issue happens and a fix is released it can be sent with an OTA update. No visit to a dealership needed.